John,
Looking to purchase a Borer for my amphib Elite as well. What pitch did you get (or recommend) 82-41, 42, 43, 44 ??
Cheers, Bob 612e
-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of John W
Sent: Thursday, August 07, 2008 3:34 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
I have an as new sensenich off my Elite # 752E for sale
if anyone is looking its got 2-3 hours after Sensenich pitched 1,850 •
• 76 EM 8S 10-O-56 Factory Fresh 3 hours as new ALL Logs Best Offer 1850.00 • Contact John W, Owner - located Duxbury, MA USA • Telephone: 6173314575 it to 56 from 58 prior to it was used about 50 hours. I replaced it with a Mcauley Borer for amphib use.
Tks
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[rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
-
Drew Dalgleish
[rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
At 03:34 AM 8/7/2008 -0700, you wrote:
6173314575 it to 56 from 58 prior to it was used about 50 hours. I
replaced it with a Mcauley Borer for amphib use.
before and after performance report on the borer prop.
Drew
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1850.00 • Contact John W, Owner - located Duxbury, MA USA • Telephone:I have an as new sensenich off my Elite # 752E for sale
if anyone is looking its got 2-3 hours after Sensenich pitched 1,850 •
• 76 EM 8S 10-O-56 Factory Fresh 3 hours as new ALL Logs Best Offer
6173314575 it to 56 from 58 prior to it was used about 50 hours. I
replaced it with a Mcauley Borer for amphib use.
Hi John There's lots of amphib users here that would really appreciate aTks
before and after performance report on the borer prop.
Drew
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Walter Klatt
[rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
Yes, when I had the 320, I always wondered what a Borer would be like.
Currently with my 360, I am using the 76 X 54 Sensenich. It is a little too
fine pitch for my engine, as I am turning 2550 static. Great take-off and
climb performance, but it will quickly over rev when I lower the nose if I
don't back off the power. In hindsight, I probably should have gone with the
76 X 56. May change it later, but first want to try some high alpine lakes
to better assess what I really need.
I've got about 45 hours now on the new engine, and I couldn't be more
pleased with the change. Besides a lot more performance, the biggest
surprise has been the fuel savings.
Walter
-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Drew
Dalgleish
Sent: August 7, 2008 5:46 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
At 03:34 AM 8/7/2008 -0700, you wrote:
6173314575 it to 56 from 58 prior to it was used about 50 hours. I
replaced it with a Mcauley Borer for amphib use.
before and after performance report on the borer prop.
Drew
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Currently with my 360, I am using the 76 X 54 Sensenich. It is a little too
fine pitch for my engine, as I am turning 2550 static. Great take-off and
climb performance, but it will quickly over rev when I lower the nose if I
don't back off the power. In hindsight, I probably should have gone with the
76 X 56. May change it later, but first want to try some high alpine lakes
to better assess what I really need.
I've got about 45 hours now on the new engine, and I couldn't be more
pleased with the change. Besides a lot more performance, the biggest
surprise has been the fuel savings.
Walter
-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of Drew
Dalgleish
Sent: August 7, 2008 5:46 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
At 03:34 AM 8/7/2008 -0700, you wrote:
1850.00 • Contact John W, Owner - located Duxbury, MA USA • Telephone:I have an as new sensenich off my Elite # 752E for sale
if anyone is looking its got 2-3 hours after Sensenich pitched 1,850 •
• 76 EM 8S 10-O-56 Factory Fresh 3 hours as new ALL Logs Best Offer
6173314575 it to 56 from 58 prior to it was used about 50 hours. I
replaced it with a Mcauley Borer for amphib use.
Hi John There's lots of amphib users here that would really appreciate aTks
before and after performance report on the borer prop.
Drew
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-
Angus McKenzie
[rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
The 0-320A2B and McCauley Klip-Tip 74 X 56 prop on our Rebel came from an
American Champion Challenger GCBC and worked great when the Rebel was on
wheels. I tried a McCauley 74 X 52 from a buddy's PA-12 (too fine) then
re-pitched our McCauley to 74 X 54 for amphibious use but it only goes to
2450 wide-open in level flight and I want to reach 2750 for the peak
horse-power range.
Forget the static rpm but it's not enough.
I have aquired a Borer 80 X 40 that was removed from another 0-320 powered
GCBC that was on straight floats.
It's been in the crate laying in the hangar for months and I'll try to
document the performance details when I try it.
I suspect the Borer will be too fine and need to be re-pitched to 43 but
will try it at 40 first.
Prop shop say's, "rule of thumb" 1" change in pitch = 75rpm.
I've been unable to fly this year so haven't made any effort to do the swap,
might get around to it in the next month but no promises, and then after
Sept.20 bow-hunting moose and deer will take full priority till New Years
eve.
.............Angus..........
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Andrews" <robert@montanasky.us>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 07, 2008 8:40 AM
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
[quote]John,
Looking to purchase a Borer for my amphib Elite as well. What pitch did
you get (or recommend) 82-41, 42, 43, 44 ??
Cheers, Bob 612e
-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of John
W
Sent: Thursday, August 07, 2008 3:34 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
I have an as new sensenich off my Elite # 752E for sale
if anyone is looking its got 2-3 hours after Sensenich pitched 1,850
â
American Champion Challenger GCBC and worked great when the Rebel was on
wheels. I tried a McCauley 74 X 52 from a buddy's PA-12 (too fine) then
re-pitched our McCauley to 74 X 54 for amphibious use but it only goes to
2450 wide-open in level flight and I want to reach 2750 for the peak
horse-power range.
Forget the static rpm but it's not enough.
I have aquired a Borer 80 X 40 that was removed from another 0-320 powered
GCBC that was on straight floats.
It's been in the crate laying in the hangar for months and I'll try to
document the performance details when I try it.
I suspect the Borer will be too fine and need to be re-pitched to 43 but
will try it at 40 first.
Prop shop say's, "rule of thumb" 1" change in pitch = 75rpm.
I've been unable to fly this year so haven't made any effort to do the swap,
might get around to it in the next month but no promises, and then after
Sept.20 bow-hunting moose and deer will take full priority till New Years
eve.
.............Angus..........
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Andrews" <robert@montanasky.us>
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 07, 2008 8:40 AM
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
[quote]John,
Looking to purchase a Borer for my amphib Elite as well. What pitch did
you get (or recommend) 82-41, 42, 43, 44 ??
Cheers, Bob 612e
-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of John
W
Sent: Thursday, August 07, 2008 3:34 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
I have an as new sensenich off my Elite # 752E for sale
if anyone is looking its got 2-3 hours after Sensenich pitched 1,850
â
-
WALTER KLATT
[rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
Yes, with my new 360, I get better fuel consumption (at least .5 gph) than my old 320 when I go the same speed, or another way of looking at it, I get 5 extra mph for the same burn rate. And my old 320 was pretty efficient as well. I know that from flying long flights with others (amphib 320 Rebels), and comparing our actual fuel used when filling up at stops. The only one that was slightly better was Bruce Georgian, but only about 1 gallon on a full tank usage. But he had an Ellison TB on his, so I attribute that to his better numbers. His plane was also the closest to performance to mine, both on take-off, climb and cruise. He had the same 150 hp 320 with the same Sensenich 74 X 54 prop. Any other amphib Rebel that I have flown with had poorer performance (side by side comparisons), and not as good fuel consumption, and that includes 160 hp 320s. I could even outperform a local wheels 160 hp Rebel with my 150 on amphibs both on climb and top speed. That's because he was using that Mc
Caulley that's been men
t
ioned here. Also, the 74 X 56 Senenich will give poorer performance on amphibs as well, which was proven too, when one of the guys changed his pitch from 56 to 54. So props make a huge difference, no doubt about it.
Getting back to my current new engine, I should mention that it is not a stock 360. It is the roller tappet Superior engine with the ECI EXP cylinders (7% more flow on these), and the LSE Plasm III EI on one side. I think it is the EI that gives the higher fuel efficiency.
On my old 320, I had to hunt around a bit at cruise to find the best combination of fuel flow and leaning (so I didn't get engine roughness) at different altitudes and speed (incl RPM), so it took a bit to achieve the best fuel efficiency with that engine. But with the new one, I can find smooth running leaning very easily at almost any combination without encountering roughness. I think that is because of the EI and the better fuel mixture to all cylinders with the Superior sump intake design. It's almost like I have FI.
Anyway, that's my experience, and my theories.
Walter
----- Original Message -----
From: Keith Leitch <im_planecrazy@yahoo.com>
Date: Thursday, August 7, 2008 7:27 am
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Caulley that's been men
t
ioned here. Also, the 74 X 56 Senenich will give poorer performance on amphibs as well, which was proven too, when one of the guys changed his pitch from 56 to 54. So props make a huge difference, no doubt about it.
Getting back to my current new engine, I should mention that it is not a stock 360. It is the roller tappet Superior engine with the ECI EXP cylinders (7% more flow on these), and the LSE Plasm III EI on one side. I think it is the EI that gives the higher fuel efficiency.
On my old 320, I had to hunt around a bit at cruise to find the best combination of fuel flow and leaning (so I didn't get engine roughness) at different altitudes and speed (incl RPM), so it took a bit to achieve the best fuel efficiency with that engine. But with the new one, I can find smooth running leaning very easily at almost any combination without encountering roughness. I think that is because of the EI and the better fuel mixture to all cylinders with the Superior sump intake design. It's almost like I have FI.
Anyway, that's my experience, and my theories.
Walter
----- Original Message -----
From: Keith Leitch <im_planecrazy@yahoo.com>
Date: Thursday, August 7, 2008 7:27 am
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
pitched 1,850Walter,
By fuel savings are you saying you get less fuel burn with the
new engine?
Keith
--- On Thu, 8/7/08, Walter Klatt <Walter.Klatt@shaw.ca> wrote:
From: Walter Klatt <Walter.Klatt@shaw.ca>
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Date: Thursday, August 7, 2008, 9:00 AM
Yes, when I had the 320, I always wondered what a Borer would be like.
Currently with my 360, I am using the 76 X 54 Sensenich. It is a
little too
fine pitch for my engine, as I am turning 2550 static. Great
take-off and
climb performance, but it will quickly over rev when I lower the
nose if I
don't back off the power. In hindsight, I probably should have
gone with
the
76 X 56. May change it later, but first want to try some high
alpine lakes
to better assess what I really need.
I've got about 45 hours now on the new engine, and I couldn't be more
pleased with the change. Besides a lot more performance, the biggest
surprise has been the fuel savings.
Walter
-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On
Behalf Of Drew
Dalgleish
Sent: August 7, 2008 5:46 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: Re: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
At 03:34 AM 8/7/2008 -0700, you wrote:I have an as new sensenich off my Elite # 752E for sale
if anyone is looking its got 2-3 hours after Sensenich
-
John W
[rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
HI Bob
My prop is 82 x 44 Turns up 2600 0n climb 750 fpm at gross 2150.
Cruise 97 knots 2450
minimal overev tendency on levelling goes just about to 2700.
Try 43 or 44 I fly close to gross performance is hugely improved
the plane pulls like a tractor off the water 10-11 secs single 80 F
sea level.
Rgds
John W
--- On Thu, 8/7/08, Bob Andrews <robert@montanasky.us> wrote:
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My prop is 82 x 44 Turns up 2600 0n climb 750 fpm at gross 2150.
Cruise 97 knots 2450
minimal overev tendency on levelling goes just about to 2700.
Try 43 or 44 I fly close to gross performance is hugely improved
the plane pulls like a tractor off the water 10-11 secs single 80 F
sea level.
Rgds
John W
--- On Thu, 8/7/08, Bob Andrews <robert@montanasky.us> wrote:
From: Bob Andrews <robert@montanasky.us>
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Date: Thursday, August 7, 2008, 5:40 AM
John,
Looking to purchase a Borer for my amphib Elite as well.
What pitch did you get (or recommend) 82-41, 42, 43, 44 ??
Cheers, Bob 612e
-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On
Behalf Of John W
Sent: Thursday, August 07, 2008 3:34 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
I have an as new sensenich off my Elite # 752E for sale
if anyone is looking its got 2-3 hours after Sensenich
pitched 1,850 •
• 76 EM 8S 10-O-56 Factory Fresh 3 hours as new ALL
Logs Best Offer 1850.00 • Contact John W, Owner -
located Duxbury, MA USA • Telephone: 6173314575 it to
56 from 58 prior to it was used about 50 hours. I replaced
it with a Mcauley Borer for amphib use.
Tks
-----------------------------------------------------------------
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-
Walter Klatt
[rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
Those are very good numbers, John, and thanks. Do you by chance know your
climb rate at 1800 or 1900 pounds? Also which floats do you have?
Very good cruise number for a Borer. And with our RPMs, sounds like almost a
perfect match for your plane.
Walter
-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of John W
Sent: August 8, 2008 5:00 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
HI Bob
My prop is 82 x 44 Turns up 2600 0n climb 750 fpm at gross 2150.
Cruise 97 knots 2450
minimal overev tendency on levelling goes just about to 2700.
Try 43 or 44 I fly close to gross performance is hugely improved
the plane pulls like a tractor off the water 10-11 secs single 80 F
sea level.
Rgds
John W
--- On Thu, 8/7/08, Bob Andrews <robert@montanasky.us> wrote:
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climb rate at 1800 or 1900 pounds? Also which floats do you have?
Very good cruise number for a Borer. And with our RPMs, sounds like almost a
perfect match for your plane.
Walter
-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of John W
Sent: August 8, 2008 5:00 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
HI Bob
My prop is 82 x 44 Turns up 2600 0n climb 750 fpm at gross 2150.
Cruise 97 knots 2450
minimal overev tendency on levelling goes just about to 2700.
Try 43 or 44 I fly close to gross performance is hugely improved
the plane pulls like a tractor off the water 10-11 secs single 80 F
sea level.
Rgds
John W
--- On Thu, 8/7/08, Bob Andrews <robert@montanasky.us> wrote:
From: Bob Andrews <robert@montanasky.us>
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Date: Thursday, August 7, 2008, 5:40 AM
John,
Looking to purchase a Borer for my amphib Elite as well.
What pitch did you get (or recommend) 82-41, 42, 43, 44 ??
Cheers, Bob 612e
-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On
Behalf Of John W
Sent: Thursday, August 07, 2008 3:34 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
I have an as new sensenich off my Elite # 752E for sale
if anyone is looking its got 2-3 hours after Sensenich
pitched 1,850 •
• 76 EM 8S 10-O-56 Factory Fresh 3 hours as new ALL
Logs Best Offer 1850.00 • Contact John W, Owner -
located Duxbury, MA USA • Telephone: 6173314575 it to
56 from 58 prior to it was used about 50 hours. I replaced
it with a Mcauley Borer for amphib use.
Tks
-----------------------------------------------------------------
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chileman88
[rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
I climb 1000 fpm under 80 F- sea level with
1575. Plane
175 pilot
125 fuel
Clamar floats amphib
These are very slippery
If I firewall the throttle
I have seen 107 knots
Of course GPH is 11 plus.
John
752E
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
-----Original Message-----
From: "Walter Klatt" <Walter.Klatt@shaw.ca>
Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2008 06:39:38
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
Those are very good numbers, John, and thanks. Do you by chance know your
climb rate at 1800 or 1900 pounds? Also which floats do you have?
Very good cruise number for a Borer. And with our RPMs, sounds like almost a
perfect match for your plane.
Walter
-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of John W
Sent: August 8, 2008 5:00 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
HI Bob
My prop is 82 x 44 Turns up 2600 0n climb 750 fpm at gross 2150.
Cruise 97 knots 2450
minimal overev tendency on levelling goes just about to 2700.
Try 43 or 44 I fly close to gross performance is hugely improved
the plane pulls like a tractor off the water 10-11 secs single 80 F
sea level.
Rgds
John W
--- On Thu, 8/7/08, Bob Andrews <robert@montanasky.us> wrote:
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1575. Plane
175 pilot
125 fuel
Clamar floats amphib
These are very slippery
If I firewall the throttle
I have seen 107 knots
Of course GPH is 11 plus.
John
752E
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
-----Original Message-----
From: "Walter Klatt" <Walter.Klatt@shaw.ca>
Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2008 06:39:38
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
Those are very good numbers, John, and thanks. Do you by chance know your
climb rate at 1800 or 1900 pounds? Also which floats do you have?
Very good cruise number for a Borer. And with our RPMs, sounds like almost a
perfect match for your plane.
Walter
-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On Behalf Of John W
Sent: August 8, 2008 5:00 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
HI Bob
My prop is 82 x 44 Turns up 2600 0n climb 750 fpm at gross 2150.
Cruise 97 knots 2450
minimal overev tendency on levelling goes just about to 2700.
Try 43 or 44 I fly close to gross performance is hugely improved
the plane pulls like a tractor off the water 10-11 secs single 80 F
sea level.
Rgds
John W
--- On Thu, 8/7/08, Bob Andrews <robert@montanasky.us> wrote:
From: Bob Andrews <robert@montanasky.us>
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Date: Thursday, August 7, 2008, 5:40 AM
John,
Looking to purchase a Borer for my amphib Elite as well.
What pitch did you get (or recommend) 82-41, 42, 43, 44 ??
Cheers, Bob 612e
-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On
Behalf Of John W
Sent: Thursday, August 07, 2008 3:34 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
I have an as new sensenich off my Elite # 752E for sale
if anyone is looking its got 2-3 hours after Sensenich
pitched 1,850 •
• 76 EM 8S 10-O-56 Factory Fresh 3 hours as new ALL
Logs Best Offer 1850.00 • Contact John W, Owner -
located Duxbury, MA USA • Telephone: 6173314575 it to
56 from 58 prior to it was used about 50 hours. I replaced
it with a Mcauley Borer for amphib use.
Tks
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robert
[rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
Thanks John, great info. Are you on MFC 2200's? I'm still not wet yet. Finishing up the gear wiring now, and have a flex line fitting to re-do. But getting there ... Are pics posted somewhere of your Elite?
Cheers, Bob 612e
www.aacnet.com/elite
Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
-----Original Message-----
From: John W <chileman88@yahoo.com>
Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2008 04:59:34
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
HI Bob
My prop is 82 x 44 Turns up 2600 0n climb 750 fpm at gross 2150.
Cruise 97 knots 2450
minimal overev tendency on levelling goes just about to 2700.
Try 43 or 44 I fly close to gross performance is hugely improved
the plane pulls like a tractor off the water 10-11 secs single 80 F
sea level.
Rgds
John W
--- On Thu, 8/7/08, Bob Andrews <robert@montanasky.us> wrote:
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Cheers, Bob 612e
www.aacnet.com/elite
Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T
-----Original Message-----
From: John W <chileman88@yahoo.com>
Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2008 04:59:34
To: <rebel-builders@dcsol.com>
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
HI Bob
My prop is 82 x 44 Turns up 2600 0n climb 750 fpm at gross 2150.
Cruise 97 knots 2450
minimal overev tendency on levelling goes just about to 2700.
Try 43 or 44 I fly close to gross performance is hugely improved
the plane pulls like a tractor off the water 10-11 secs single 80 F
sea level.
Rgds
John W
--- On Thu, 8/7/08, Bob Andrews <robert@montanasky.us> wrote:
From: Bob Andrews <robert@montanasky.us>
Subject: RE: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Date: Thursday, August 7, 2008, 5:40 AM
John,
Looking to purchase a Borer for my amphib Elite as well.
What pitch did you get (or recommend) 82-41, 42, 43, 44 ??
Cheers, Bob 612e
-----Original Message-----
From: mike.davis@dcsol.com [mailto:mike.davis@dcsol.com] On
Behalf Of John W
Sent: Thursday, August 07, 2008 3:34 AM
To: rebel-builders@dcsol.com
Subject: [rebel-builders] sensenich prop FS
I have an as new sensenich off my Elite # 752E for sale
if anyone is looking its got 2-3 hours after Sensenich
pitched 1,850 •
• 76 EM 8S 10-O-56 Factory Fresh 3 hours as new ALL
Logs Best Offer 1850.00 • Contact John W, Owner -
located Duxbury, MA USA • Telephone: 6173314575 it to
56 from 58 prior to it was used about 50 hours. I replaced
it with a Mcauley Borer for amphib use.
Tks
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